how do youtubers get such clean connections like this?

[bbursley]

4 minutes ago, N3CR0 said:

I'm not saying they don't have advantage due to connection. I'm saying that skill is still involved. You can have the best connection in the world but if you can't aim for shit and your reactions are rubbish, you're not gonna get anywhere. I don't even know how I ever played CoD without Kontrol Freaks. My aim is still not that great but the difference between using KF's and not is night and day.

Ive used control freaks, I consider those more placebo than anything. I used to use the CQC one and "thought" they helped me, and maybe they did. But muscle memory and hand eye coordination is alot more effective in my opinion. Ive been using the OEM sticks now and I dont think I would ever go back. what really DOES help is having some tension in the spring that controls the analog sticks. Id go back to 360 and my aim would be better simply because it was harder to overcorrect yourself with the extra tension involved. The xbox one x is alot looser feeling. I think when you add the height you reduce overcorrection that alot of people do. I noticed this and made it a commitment to just lowering my sensitivity or using whatever sight helps me with my hand eye coordination. Its like driving a car for the first time, it feels weird and its harder to stay in the lines depending on what you focus on, but in time you ajust and then you dont even think about it aymore. Alertness and any form of cognitive enhancement benefits a person over any extra proprietary tools tbh. Its about having neuro plasticity to strengthen connections that turn into a permanent effect.

[bbursley]

6 minutes ago, N3CR0 said:

He's said in many videos that the server is basically in his back garden. I'm assuming he has FTTP 1g/1g and his base ping is 1-2ms.

I thought I once heard him say he uses a Netduma R1. I could be wrong though.

Also, you say Netduma is causing inconsistency but EliteShot uses one and seems to have little trouble getting consistent matches.

Eliteshot also has Fiber as well, he could match with a player host and still mow people down. Verizon Fios, Google fiber, ATT fiber are all premium fiber companies in America. I cant tell you how many times I get destroyed by people with fiber, or have been in parties with people who do so they literally wreck the lobby. I didnt know that he was that close though, so clearly hes literally routing right to it almost as if hes conencted as directly to it as possible. I guess that could explain alot of the "advantage" we see in some of these people. Also Eliteshot lives in new york, if he gets that dedicated server with fiber, its over for everyone. I guess location of server, routing and connection type are all key factors that must be rolled into one to have a godly connection like we see from these guys. I feel you on the domination thing though. what works best for me is if I can be the lowest ping in the lobby and everyone else is higher. An issue I see a netduma causing though is players who might otherwise have a BAD connection being able to force themselves onto an otherwise perfect server. Say im in germany and I wanna connect to the server in the USA. Im gonna 3 bar for sure and im going to ruin everyone elses day because of it. So while the netduma can help some people it can also cause issues for those who didnt ask for it. If for instance Im forcing to my usual server and germany guy does to...well then its a really 50/50 on who wins, probably he will. I had that happen to me already and I was so pissed off that no matter what I did I couldnt touch him. Wasnt it back in MW2 where people said ping was ping and if you lagged it was just unfortunate for you? yeah they should bring that back.....

[RiotControll]

2 minutes ago, bbursley said:

Wasnt it back in MW2 where people said ping was ping and if you lagged it was just unfortunate for you? yeah they should bring that back.....

MW2 by far had the best connections and hitdetection. Since then connections got worse every year. 

[N3CR0]

4 minutes ago, RiotControll said:

MW2 by far had the best connections and hitdetection. Since then connections got worse every year. 

Not for me they weren't. I actually stopped playing that game after a guy set off my claymore and as he was stunned I put 3 shots of a shotgun at point blank range at him and he just one shot me!

The claymore should've killed him, nevermind my shooting him. But back then I duno how good my internet was. I didn't monitor anything back then.

CoD4 and Ghosts for me was by far the best for connection. Don't think I ever had shoot first die first in either of them games. No gaming monitor, no gaming router, no fancy controllers or KF's. Then AW came out and it all seemed to go backwards connection wise and seemed to only get worse with every CoD after until I got my Duma R1.

[bbursley]

4 minutes ago, RiotControll said:

MW2 by far had the best connections and hitdetection. Since then connections got worse every year. 

Infinity ward games usually do have great hit detection honestly. I hardy ever had many issues on those games, unless the host was in another country you really didnt have to many issues. Idk why these developers cant get with the concept and stop tweaking it in every direction. In MW2 you even had these massive streaks flying around too. I miss having that, it was definitely really cool. Heres to hoping cod 2018 brings those things back in "MW4" or whatever it might be.

[bbursley]

3 minutes ago, N3CR0 said:

Not for me they weren't. I actually stopped playing that game after a guy set off my claymore and as he was stunned I put 3 shots of a shotgun at point blank range at him and he just one shot me!

The claymore should've killed him, nevermind my shooting him. But back then I duno how good my internet was. I didn't monitor anything back then.

CoD4 and Ghosts for me was by far the best for connection. Don't think I ever had shoot first die first in either of them games. No gaming monitor, no gaming router, no fancy controllers or KF's. Then AW came out and it all seemed to go backwards connection wise and seemed to only get worse with every CoD after until I got my Duma R1.

absolutely! the original cod4 and ghosts were fantastic for hit detection. In fact ghosts was almost too good, you'd be melting people. I still jump on there from time to time to relive that experience, unfortunately it is and always has been infested by campers. But if you keep your awareness up you can generally melt them if youre accurate. I have idk how many hundreds of thousands of kills in that game, even was one of the first cods I got really noticed in by many players because it was easy to get kills consistently. My cousin played it over wifi on a old tube TV and still did well both in MP and GB's lmao. God why did they ruin netcode over the years. AW was really bad without host filtering too. Though whats weird is I had played it on other peoples internet with the same ISP and no netduma and the connection was always solid, (and over wifi lol). We have to just pray to the COD gods we get treated more fairly in the coming years or games like fortnite and apex are going to continue to squash it into the ground. Sure there will be cod fans but itll just die out and gain worse and worse rep every year till its worthless if they dont make that change.

[RiotControll]

15 minutes ago, bbursley said:

Infinity ward games usually do have great hit detection honestly. I hardy ever had many issues on those games, unless the host was in another country you really didnt have to many issues. 

Infinity Ward generally ruins the game for me in January with their 1. major map pack patch. The connections are garbage then. 

15 minutes ago, bbursley said:

Idk why these developers cant get with the concept and stop tweaking it in every direction. 

Because they want to please everyone that's the problem.

[N3CR0]

Creating a whole new engine would be an idea. Why are they still using the same one from CoD2??? That was almost 15 years ago ffs.

[Bert]

I have often wondered about this.

 

Obviously you can't rule out skill. They have good reaction times and often if you see a good player play, they attack from the sides or in the back and position themselves carefully giving them the upper hand.

Also they only show their best games. If you watch a YT video of them going 107-1 and their overall K/D is 3.5, then they are good but these very high kill games are exceptional.

 

I have wondered about the connections sometimes though. And have often thought that they are using business / enterprise grade connections. Makes sense if you think about it, when you need to make a living from YT. Consumer ISP's are often heavily oversubscribed and because of the nature of consumer traffic, they feature a assymetrical traffic shaping pattern, ie biassed towards downloading. And the average consumer primairily uses a lot of download. So it leads to the situation where during peak hours and overcongestion, the download gets clogged up. UDP gaming traffic is not generally prioritized by ISP's. If you see your ping rise during peak hours, that often means that your actual game traffic (UDP) is far more delayed than just ping suggests. And this lag is assymetrical, only towards you but not towards the server. What this means for gaming is that your packets reach the server and upodate the game but game updates reach you later, so that's why you see the enemies later (or they seem to see you first, the famous "deer in headlights" killcam)

 

Business grade connections are generally more symmetrically shaped and should have better hardware and less oversubscription on the ISP side of things.

 

Just speculation but that is one of my theories. It would also explain why in a lot of cases users report succes with adding extra delay on their upload or upload throttling (so that their upstream ping gets higher) Obviously it would be nicer if your connection was good to start off with since throttling will make your hitdetetcion slower.

[simjc]

BO4s netcode as we all know is not great. There are things you can do and there are things that are out of your control.

No control over

• Netcode
• SBMM + lobby balancing, i.e. all noobs on your team vs all the sweats on the other
• The consistently inconsistent online experience, down to netcode + lag comp algorithms

Have control over

• Home network setup (bufferbloat control etc.)
• ISP (may be some regions, only have 1 choice)
  • UK there are options.
  • Hops will impact latency
    • BT for example 8 hops to a known server
    • AA 5 hops to known server
  • Line quality - if poor this will greatly impact your online gaming experience (I know currently suffering from this)
    • BAD ISP = no fault found, not repairing, give me your money
    • GOOD ISP = fault detected, will repair
    • Once got good line quality (no more random packet loss, 1250ms ping spikes etc) gaming experience in general will be better

So you have all the best things in the world at your end, but fundamentally if the game servers are oversubscribed (causing what appears to be packet loss but is not), and the server and client netcode is poor, the gaming experience overall will be poor and there is no magic bullet that you can apply.

 

Sim

 

[N3CR0]

15 hours ago, simjc said:

BAD ISP = no fault found, not repairing, give me your money

I believe they just go by BT these days mate LOL.

Anyways, I swear when I was on interleaving with a 28ms ping, BOps4 played better...

[Netduma Alex]

It's possible they have business broadband. Home broadband often has high download but low upload, business broadband often has similar upload speeds to the download speeds. That would be my guess. If you're making that big streamer money, maybe you can afford that big streamer internet.

[ColonicBoom]

On 4/16/2019 at 2:56 PM, N3CR0 said:

SeanEDawgs was a great player, had hundreds of nukes on IW and I saw him play on some of the shittiest, laggiest internet and still get nukes.

Skill still comes into it. Excellent connection or not, if I ran at the enemies spawn, I would be lucky to kill one player, let alone 3-4 like TMem does.

I'm a bit late to the party but wasn't it SeanEDawgs that got caught doing some dirty tricks with his connection to try to cheat?

[N3CR0]

53 minutes ago, ColonicBoom said:

I'm a bit late to the party but wasn't it SeanEDawgs that got caught doing some dirty tricks with his connection to try to cheat?

I didn't hear anything like that. If it was him, I probably would've as I watched his vids all the time.

After a quick Google search, nothing about him cheating has come up. I know he was having mental problems and thats probably why he stopped doing YT.

He also really hated playing WW2 but was forcing himself to play it for channel content... doing something every day you don't enjoy, probably just added to his mental state. Just noticed he hasn't posted anything on Twitter since last year.

Just noticed that he got Dark Matter on BOps4 just 72 hours after the game came out and everyone called him a cheat and booster. Maybe thats what you heard about?

[Netduma Alex]

9 hours ago, N3CR0 said:

doing something every day you don't enjoy, probably just added to his mental state

Seems to me like 90% of the people working in offices around the world feel like that.

Not me though, I should say 🙄

[N3CR0]

2 hours ago, Netduma Alex said:

Seems to me like 90% of the people working in offices around the world feel like that.

Not me though, I should say 🙄

True but thats different. He was also at uni so had other things going on. Also, his family didn't support his YT career, they thought it was stupid and pointless despite him making a good amount of money from it.

Again, probably not helping his mental state.

[Netduma Alex]

Yeah I get that. Playing video games isn't a real career because... Erm... It's too fun? Who knows.

Playing video games for a living probably kills a lot of the fun. It's all about balance in life.

[N3CR0]

43 minutes ago, Netduma Alex said:

Yeah I get that. Playing video games isn't a real career because... Erm... It's too fun? Who knows.

Playing video games for a living probably kills a lot of the fun. It's all about balance in life.

Maybe but if he was earning enough to put himself through uni so mummy and daddy didn't have to... they should've defo been supporting him for that reason alone.

[Netduma Alex]

Oh yeah for sure.

[purpleandgold33]

On 4/14/2019 at 10:06 AM, RiotControll said:

Bullshit, skill is long ago gone in COD. COD is very connection depending. If someones server sync is better than yours, no matter what you'll lose the gunfights all day long.

Dude you are 100% correct with this statement. I've been saying this for years. I have been playing cod since MW2 and get destroyed by nobody's on blackout. I would say 1 out 40 to 50 games the server doesn't lag or rubberband, sponge my bullets in a gun fight. I have every piece of equipment that I can buy. Pro controller Astro A40's with mixamp. Ben Q 1ms monitor, decent internet 200 down/10 up. My base ping is 17ms. I just recently put away the R1 and purchased the XR500. No better at all. The R1 back when it came out worked like a champ. I honestly don't know what happened since then. Nothing makes sense in that matter. I've wanted to come on here and bitch at duma. But I know its just the shitty servers that they never work on i.e. activision. All I want is the playing field to be level and not have ppl turn around and kill me after I've already put 5 bullets into their back or loose frames when I have a close quarters battle. Its complete bs. I swear the game played better when it was p2p connection, except when dudes would hit lag switches. Just my 2 cents!

[purpleandgold33]

On 4/15/2019 at 9:58 PM, bbursley said:

Facts. When I used to get host on call of duty ghosts it was so unfair for everyone else. I actually got banned for a week because so many people reported me (and I never had a Jtag either) or any other way of cheating. I just got host a lot. Due to that I had the best connection of anyone else. I would literally murder people like it was nobody’s business. I would loop streaks so often people rage quit. My kid was and still is well over a 3 and I don’t even get host anymore. When I had good lobbies in black ops 2 same deal, it would literally rain streaks so bad people just had to leave. So I’d wait to use my streaks again and guess what? Surprise! Out come all those streaks I saved up still. Even on black ops 3 now I’m still getting 30-50 kills a match. What’s inconsistent is the Netduma. But also it’s fair to argue those 3 bar players are annoying too. Connections definitely matter. Routing matters. But the point is how many people have connections like that? Spratt had that same connection in the UK and he has it anywhere he goes. I’m not saying those guys never have bad games, but it’s crazy when most people who are beasts are still struggling. Also it’s true that ping is kind because I’ve lost so many gunfights to trash players simply because my bullets were just hitmarkers and theirs were not. Connection is absolutely an advantage. 

I would consider myself an above average player. Maybe not on blackout but when I played multi I was usually the best player in the lobby 80% of the time. 

[bbursley]

On 6/10/2019 at 7:45 AM, Bert said:

I have often wondered about this.

 

Obviously you can't rule out skill. They have good reaction times and often if you see a good player play, they attack from the sides or in the back and position themselves carefully giving them the upper hand.

Also they only show their best games. If you watch a YT video of them going 107-1 and their overall K/D is 3.5, then they are good but these very high kill games are exceptional.

 

I have wondered about the connections sometimes though. And have often thought that they are using business / enterprise grade connections. Makes sense if you think about it, when you need to make a living from YT. Consumer ISP's are often heavily oversubscribed and because of the nature of consumer traffic, they feature a assymetrical traffic shaping pattern, ie biassed towards downloading. And the average consumer primairily uses a lot of download. So it leads to the situation where during peak hours and overcongestion, the download gets clogged up. UDP gaming traffic is not generally prioritized by ISP's. If you see your ping rise during peak hours, that often means that your actual game traffic (UDP) is far more delayed than just ping suggests. And this lag is assymetrical, only towards you but not towards the server. What this means for gaming is that your packets reach the server and upodate the game but game updates reach you later, so that's why you see the enemies later (or they seem to see you first, the famous "deer in headlights" killcam)

 

Business grade connections are generally more symmetrically shaped and should have better hardware and less oversubscription on the ISP side of things.

 

Just speculation but that is one of my theories. It would also explain why in a lot of cases users report succes with adding extra delay on their upload or upload throttling (so that their upstream ping gets higher) Obviously it would be nicer if your connection was good to start off with since throttling will make your hitdetetcion slower.

Actually I looked into business and potentially gigabit cable, but speed means nothing when neither is better than the other. I don’t have enough devices to warrant higher than my plan, and I was told that due to net neutrality agreements that ISPs don’t offer any benefit from residential to business, just more priority in terms of issues arising, static IPs etc. now if I was to run fiber straight to my house from the Maine office, that may yield an edge. Sadly the USA is so behind in fiber technology it’s kinda pathetic. Yet other places have tons of fiber and even multi gigabit speeds 🙁

[bbursley]

I have been locked on black desert online, I’m enjoying it and all it’s crappy moments, but I at least know the game is about working for what you deserve versus just a simple “connection advantage “. Though I will say, I think my R1 is starting to crap out and I don’t know if another Netduma is in my future....that edge router seems quite enticing 🤷🏻‍♂️ And for a fraction of the cost. Guess we will see though. It’s that or maybe the xr 500? Idk yet 

[Netduma Alex]

That's the advantage to MMOs over shooters I guess, although the two seem to be getting closer all the time.

What I like about MMOs is that as long as you connection is reasonably good you'll have no disadvantage, thanks to global cooldown.

[Bert]

On 7/23/2019 at 9:24 AM, bbursley said:

Actually I looked into business and potentially gigabit cable, but speed means nothing when neither is better than the other. I don’t have enough devices to warrant higher than my plan, and I was told that due to net neutrality agreements that ISPs don’t offer any benefit from residential to business, just more priority in terms of issues arising, static IPs etc. now if I was to run fiber straight to my house from the Maine office, that may yield an edge. Sadly the USA is so behind in fiber technology it’s kinda pathetic. Yet other places have tons of fiber and even multi gigabit speeds 🙁

I have also looked into this. In Europe it's actually very affordable up to 1GB up/down. Also you can specify what you are looking for, low latency etc.

 

You can even get 10Gbit but that is pricey.

 

There is definitly a difference when you are using your own lease line. You simply connect straight into a backbone and there is no oversubscription going on like you have with a normal residential ISP. You would still be affected by traffic on the backbone and the servers but usually the ISP is the worst for creating lag. For a big Youtuber it's definitly worth the investment.

 

My place in Asia has a eSport connection since a few weeks. That means that I get 2 separate connections coming in over 1 fiber cable. 1x home connection PPPoE which uses a shared IP adress like normal with 300/300 mbps bandwith. And the actual eSport system which also offers 300/300 mbps but has a lower latency and a actual public IP adress. I checked the routing and it is actually different plus my XR500 really shows a drop in latency.

 

I have noticed there is issues with the servers though. Normally I play on the Singapore server, the best one gives me 33ms ping while another gives me 41ms ping. You can tell by the domain names. I have watched this for a while and there is one specific which always gives me the best connection. Which is weird since they should be run of the same cloud. (SG server is Amazon Cloud) The Tokyo server is Vultr and is still running 30Hz. A number of USA servers are also reporting 30Hz. Europe is fine for most part.