XR500 + Netgear X6S Mesh Network

[AsNCo]

Hi. As stated in the title, I have now added this Wifi Extender with Mesh functionality to my home and the connection between the XR500 and the X6S works perfectly. The best speed I could get furthest in my house was 44.2Mbps down and 49.8Mbps up while with the X6S, it is now 223Mbps down and 165Mbps up.
With the X6S, my phone does roam in the same network between the XR500 and the X6S seamlessly as seen in the Netgear Wifi Analytics app.

However, the issue that I encounter now is a number of "unnamed device" appearing in my Device Manager on the XR500. They appear to have the same IP address that I have already reserved for specific devices under Lan Settings but they now have different MAC addresses and some of these devices are not even in use but is now taking up the reserved IP address slots.

The Device Manager is now a mess full of Unnamed Devices taking up the slots. Any solution would be appreciated.

[Netduma Jack]

2 hours ago, AsNCo said:

Hi. As stated in the title, I have now added this Wifi Extender with Mesh functionality to my home and the connection between the XR500 and the X6S works perfectly. The best speed I could get furthest in my house was 44.2Mbps down and 49.8Mbps up while with the X6S, it is now 223Mbps down and 165Mbps up.
With the X6S, my phone does roam in the same network between the XR500 and the X6S seamlessly as seen in the Netgear Wifi Analytics app.

However, the issue that I encounter now is a number of "unnamed device" appearing in my Device Manager on the XR500. They appear to have the same IP address that I have already reserved for specific devices under Lan Settings but they now have different MAC addresses and some of these devices are not even in use but is now taking up the reserved IP address slots.

The Device Manager is now a mess full of Unnamed Devices taking up the slots. Any solution would be appreciated.

If any of these devices are offline, can you not delete them? Do you believe these unnamed devices are linked to your WiFi roaming, or do you have any idea what they might be?

If these devices don't exist (i.e it looks to be a bug, or a new unnamed device being made every time the mac address changes on your device) you should be able to delete them.

[AsNCo]

34 minutes ago, Netduma Jack said:

If any of these devices are offline, can you not delete them? Do you believe these unnamed devices are linked to your WiFi roaming, or do you have any idea what they might be?

If these devices don't exist (i.e it looks to be a bug, or a new unnamed device being made every time the mac address changes on your device) you should be able to delete them.

It seems like any Wireless devices that connect through the X6S will have the first 6 MAC addresses be exactly the same as the MAC address for the 5GHz network of the X6S.
 

For illustration, X6S 5GHz MAC address: 02:0F:B5:**:**:**.
Now, any devices that are connected through the X6S Mesh network will have its first 6 MAC address changed to "02:0F:B5:" followed by their last 6 original MAC address when seen in the Device Manager of the XR500 causing a LOT of new 'unnamed device' appearing (even after I deleted them in the Device Manager) since they are still the same device just on a different node (X6S).

As the devices move throughout the house and if they have a fixed IP address that I have allocated through LAN settings, they will cause new unnamed device to pop up in the device manager though still maintaining the same IP address.

So now I have 2 copies of each wireless device in my device manager with 1 having their original names and the other having unnamed device as their name with only the last 6 MAC address being the same.

Sorry if I seem to be repeating. This is so confusing and there seems to be no way of solving this unless a fix is made for this issue.

[Netduma Jack]

Thank you for bringing this to our attention - this seems like something we will need to investigate and find a solution for. We already plan to implement a 'table mode' for people with many devices, which will at least make the Device Manager usable in these kinds of situations.

Could you send us a screenshot or two of this issue? That would help us a lot in understanding the issue.

There's a thread discussing a similar issue here if you want to check that out: 

 

[AsNCo]

11 hours ago, Netduma Jack said:

Thank you for bringing this to our attention - this seems like something we will need to investigate and find a solution for. We already plan to implement a 'table mode' for people with many devices, which will at least make the Device Manager usable in these kinds of situations.

Could you send us a screenshot or two of this issue? That would help us a lot in understanding the issue.

There's a thread discussing a similar issue here if you want to check that out: 

 

Thanks. Take note, I've deleted and tried to rename some duplicates. So it will look slightly less cluttered now. But will these duplicates affect the quality of the connection on QoS if it is set to Always right due to each getting even lesser bandwidth as more devices connect?

Here's the result for what my Phone will usually be set to. It has a reserved IP address for it. And the same IP address will be used once it switches to the X6S node.

When connected to XR500


When connected to X6S


In reference, here's the X6S on 5GHz network's MAC address. Notice the first 6 alphanumerics that look the same as the unnamed device version of my phone.

[Netduma Fraser]

This is an issue we're literally reproducing now so we can work on a fix. Basically as far as I can tell, the extender is creating a separate device by giving it a virtual MAC address similar to the original. As its different the router doesn't know what it is. Most likely the the fix will be to scan for/allow detection of virtual MAC addresses and therefore just keep it to the original device name and would stop unnamed devices. We're using the EX8000 also so this is the exact issue we're seeing so rest assured it will be fixed.

[e38BimmerFN]

I can also confirm this with my XR450 and EX7700. Both run well together, however the device manager/network map is a mess when looking at it and seeing lots of unknown devices. Makes it hard to tell what is what especially when you have 20-30 devices connected.

Hope this can be fixed at some point. Please let me know if I can be of any help.

[Netduma Jack]

I'm sure it will be resolved soon Bimmer - and even if the source can't be stamped out, there will be a Table View mode soon enough which will make the problem much more bearable. Keep an eye out for these solutions in future firmware releases

[e38BimmerFN]

Will do, I presume this isn't an easy fix. LOL. Would there be any changes seen on the EX#### or extender model side? Just curious. I also have a EX7500 as well I should pull out and test with.

I would presume that users need to ensure there extender FW is up to date as well. 😉

[Netduma Fraser]

17 minutes ago, e38BimmerFN said:

Will do, I presume this isn't an easy fix. LOL. Would there be any changes seen on the EX#### or extender model side? Just curious. I also have a EX7500 as well I should pull out and test with.

I would presume that users need to ensure there extender FW is up to date as well. 😉

The fix will be on the router side but of course always a good idea to keep the extender firmware up to date.

[AsNCo]

On 9/13/2018 at 12:03 AM, Netduma Fraser said:

This is an issue we're literally reproducing now so we can work on a fix. Basically as far as I can tell, the extender is creating a separate device by giving it a virtual MAC address similar to the original. As its different the router doesn't know what it is. Most likely the the fix will be to scan for/allow detection of virtual MAC addresses and therefore just keep it to the original device name and would stop unnamed devices. We're using the EX8000 also so this is the exact issue we're seeing so rest assured it will be fixed.

Wow! This is great news! And the fast response to get a solution to this issue is much appreciated.
 

1 hour ago, Netduma Jack said:

I'm sure it will be resolved soon Bimmer - and even if the source can't be stamped out, there will be a Table View mode soon enough which will make the problem much more bearable. Keep an eye out for these solutions in future firmware releases

As much as I appreciate a Table View, will this still pose a problem for the QoS's Bandwidth allocation where now ever device gets even less allocation as the number of device increases?

[Netduma Fraser]

17 minutes ago, AsNCo said:

Wow! This is great news! And the fast response to get a solution to this issue is much appreciated.
 

As much as I appreciate a Table View, will this still pose a problem for the QoS's Bandwidth allocation where now ever device gets even less allocation as the number of device increases?

It would be the same as before as Bandwidth Allocation isn't being affected. Just a different way to view devices connected to the router

[xr500user]

17 hours ago, Netduma Fraser said:

It would be the same as before as Bandwidth Allocation isn't being affected. Just a different way to view devices connected to the router

Hi Fraser,

I think what he means is how it may effect bandwidth allocation in the QoS section -- for sake of example, if you had a small ISP download bandwidth of 15mbps and 6 actual devices or so on your network -- the bandwidth allocation area automatically divides remaining bandwidth (after anti bufferbloat sliders are set) between the 6 devices.. lets say it gives them (2)mbps each --Yes Share Excess option would be no issue with this as any unused bandwidth will be given to those that need it --- but if you have 20 extra 'unknown' devices being detected over time during wifi roaming they also get a piece of that pie in the list, it would be pretty bad if share excess is disabled in that case (15mbps /20+ dupes instead of 6 actual). Unless they aren't online and won't effect it, but it could get very messy looking in there also ..

[Netduma Fraser]

Oh I see, well I actually tested the fix for this yesterday and because a device that had connected to the router when wifi extender wasn't being used has a different MAC address to when it's connected to the extender it created two different devices but couldn't tell what it was called when connected to the extender. Now it's merged into one device with both MAC addresses and keeps the name so this will resolve that issue.

[DustoMan]

Thank you so much for working on this. After the recent firmware update, I looked at the device manager and found this: It's un-usable.

[Netduma Admin]

2 hours ago, DustoMan said:

Thank you so much for working on this. After the recent firmware update, I looked at the device manager and found this: It's un-usable.

I don’t blame you! Looks like a planet. We’re onto it 👍

[AsNCo]

7 hours ago, Netduma Fraser said:

Oh I see, well I actually tested the fix for this yesterday and because a device that had connected to the router when wifi extender wasn't being used has a different MAC address to when it's connected to the extender it created two different devices but couldn't tell what it was called when connected to the extender. Now it's merged into one device with both MAC addresses and keeps the name so this will resolve that issue.

Wow! That is super fast. Thank you so much! Looking forward to the update once it has been approved from both sides for us to get. Much appreciated for rectifying the issue as fast as you can.

[Netduma Admin]

13 hours ago, AsNCo said:

Wow! That is super fast. Thank you so much! Looking forward to the update once it has been approved from both sides for us to get. Much appreciated for rectifying the issue as fast as you can.

That's DumaOS! Makes it so much easier for us to develop new features. We'll be announcing more on this soon.

[TheDude2850]

Is this still an ongoing issue?  Looking to potentially buy an X6S.

[DustoMan]

I recently added a MoCA coax backhaul connection and switched the extender to AP mode and I no longer have this issue. So it seems to only happen if you put the X6S in Extender mode. There was a recent firmware update to the X6S but the changelog says they added automatic firmware updates and the option to send telemetry data back to Netgear. I don't think there were any fixes that were noted. The XR500 has not had any firmware updates so I have to assume that this is still an issue.

[e38BimmerFN]

Yes this is still an issue. Hopefully next FW update will have something. 

[Netduma Fraser]

We've fixed this issue so it will be present in the next firmware version.

[AsNCo]

It's been 1 month since my last post. The number of unnamed devices has increased quite a lot.
I didn't expect getting the fix my way will take this long. 😅
Still patiently waiting. At least it is not a game breaking bug. That's a relief.

[Netduma Admin]

I think you’ll love the new update to the device manager. Just waiting on testing before it reaches full rollout. 

[xr500user]

I have an old R7000 in AP mode on my network - The wifi roaming on it works pretty seamlessly (no wifi drops) but once you roam onto it you can't be seen by device manager. You just drop off the online list.. The xr500 still sees you in the network monitor area when you are using bandwidth, but device manager is blind to you if you're behind the AP.. it doesn't create "unnamed devices" at all with AP connection points for me (this is extender behavior changing of the device macs)  it's just device manager blind to your online activity... hopefully it fixes this issue too?

xr500user