Major Announcement: Netduma partner with NETGEAR to launch the Nighthawk XR500 Gaming Router

[iAmMoDBoX]

i like that theres finally some progress though i have two question to Luke and Iain

 

@Iain

are Anti-Jitter and Anti-Spike still a thing?

i remember those 5ms max spike lab tests on 100% bandwidth load but there hasnt been any news on that since 2 years

the DumaOS is nice but so are other router OS too, the features are what separates Netduma from the competition

 

 

@Luke

why would your company want to team up with basically the biggest competitor you have in the gaming branch?

instead of launching a second "pro" router with better specs along side the R1 you boost the sales of a competitor, that really doesnt make much sense to me other than this being the first step of being bought by netgear alltogether

that CES fame could be all yours (well if you tried to push into the CES which isnt easy and pricy) but instead you share that fame with a big competitor, who in the long run will be the only one to remain in the peoples head

i wonder how many tech sites do get their facts right and mention "Netgear with an OS made by Netduma" rather than "Netgear with their new DumaOS" with the latter making it really hard for a newcomer to learn about Netduma

 

Netgear QoS sucks in comparison to Netduma's

[Od1n]

Netduma community

 

i just finished watching all the introduction videos and reading the stuff on DumaOS

in case i missed something, please tell me as someone having a R1 why would i want to upgrade to DumaOS?

to me it looks like theres nothing new in there apart from better deep packet processing

the network monitor is the same, the QoS is the same, and man i would wish to say the geofilter is the same too but its even worse missing out ping assist

 

why did it take 2 years to develop basically a reskin of what we already have?!

i would understand it if now everything is company-side coded and no longer something being build uppon tomato/dd-wrt/whatever the basis or the R1 was...

 

please community tell me what i have missed

i cannot see anything that screams "here are the two years of work we ve been hiding", where is that artificial intelligence that does the whole tweaking for me, with this OS i still have to do everything manually

Netduma stands for innovation, help me Iain what did i miss

[Od1n]

heres a coverage on the netduma router by germanys biggest newspaper/tabloid

you might not be german to understand it but not a single word is being said about Netduma or DumaOS, it 100% sounds like its a Netgear achievement :/

and the only other german news site that picked up this topic didnt mention Netduma or DumaOS either

sounds like a really good PR for Netgear, doesnt it? :s

 

http://www.computerbild.de/artikel/cb-News-DSL-WLAN-Netgear-Nighthawk-Pro-Gaming-XR500-19604413.html

[sharpz44]

heres a coverage on the netduma router by germanys biggest newspaper/tabloid

you might not be german to understand it but not a single word is being said about Netduma or DumaOS, it 100% sounds like its a Netgear achievement :/

and the only other german news site that picked up this topic didnt mention Netduma or DumaOS either

sounds like a really good PR for Netgear, doesnt it? :s

 

http://www.computerbild.de/artikel/cb-News-DSL-WLAN-Netgear-Nighthawk-Pro-Gaming-XR500-19604413.html

On a side note...apex good

[Netduma Fraser]

It might be easier, as a quick fix, to allow for multiple instances of the filter radius; as long as the overlap is handled. If Ping Assist isn't going to be in DumaOS, then it would be nice if those of us in the US had something else that gives us more control of who we connect to.

 

That is something that we would like to do. Don't worry all your favourite features will be implemented.

 

i like that theres finally some progress though i have two question to Luke and Iain

 

@Iain

are Anti-Jitter and Anti-Spike still a thing?

i remember those 5ms max spike lab tests on 100% bandwidth load but there hasnt been any news on that since 2 years

the DumaOS is nice but so are other router OS too, the features are what separates Netduma from the competition

 

Yes that is still a thing and will be implemented into DumaOS don't worry!

 

Netduma community

 

i just finished watching all the introduction videos and reading the stuff on DumaOS

in case i missed something, please tell me as someone having a R1 why would i want to upgrade to DumaOS?

to me it looks like theres nothing new in there apart from better deep packet processing

the network monitor is the same, the QoS is the same, and man i would wish to say the geofilter is the same too but its even worse missing out ping assist

 

why did it take 2 years to develop basically a reskin of what we already have?!

i would understand it if now everything is company-side coded and no longer something being build uppon tomato/dd-wrt/whatever the basis or the R1 was...

 

please community tell me what i have missed

i cannot see anything that screams "here are the two years of work we ve been hiding", where is that artificial intelligence that does the whole tweaking for me, with this OS i still have to do everything manually

Netduma stands for innovation, help me Iain what did i miss

 

Remember this is just the first version of a stable DumaOS which is what we need to start then churning out rapid updates with new features. Don't worry your favourite features will be implemented!

 

It is not a reskin, it is an entirely new operating system and with that allows us to implement new features rapidly! QoS is actually way more automatic now, when it detects you are playing a game it will automatically prioritise it and then automatically apply your chosen Anti-Flood/Anti-Bufferbloat settings.

 

DumaOS will be very different to this first release version in the long run. In fact the new update that is about to drop already has significant changes including profiles for the Geo-Filter and is much much more user friendly!

[XSXS]

 

Only one dashboard, so no sharing

 

I'm not sure what you mean by sharing exactly. Can you describe a sharing scenario?

 

• I haven't seen such low hanging fruit since they forgot to put pants on my grandpa at his funeral, but I digress...   

 

I don't understand this point, it is a router interface so you need to login to access it. Could you elaborate?

 

• In answer to the previous and this question, I thought that the Dashboard might be accessible outside of the main router settings. I had hoped that there would be an ability to save a Dashboard so that multiple users could have their own and that one could have several configured Dashboards for different games/uses. As it stands, the Dashboard is only accessible by whomever maintains your home network and giving little ones access is inviting disaster. 

 

 

 

I don't recall any router having this sort of feature.  I do think it would be a cool feature but at the same time, if you can not trust or control your kids then that is a parenting issue.  My son plays Xbox and I showed him how to use the geo filter and he knows if he screws with any other settings he won't be playing Xbox anymore!  As for room mates, just turn off the Geo filter when they play, however what kind of room mates would they be if they screwed with your settings to mess with you or anyone?  Sounds like you (general you) would just need a new room mate.  This should not be listed as "bad" but as a requested feature in the future IMHO.

 

So the upgrade to our Netduma, will have the same power as this new Netgear router? It should, after all we bought the Netduma because it was promoted as the best out there. And all the new innovations would keep us there. Now you've taken the best, and put in someone elses product. If we don't get that, we should at least get to trade ours in for the Netgear. Plus shipping, of course.

 

 

Customer service is a lost art. With the competition out there, the last thing you should want to do, is hurt your customer. If you read a bad review it goes a lot farther, than good. Sorry but that's business. Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong about making a business decision to get better, but don't screw your base. They made your business successful.

 

Serious?  The R1 hardware is a few years old and you expect a discount for new hardware? lol, no router company does that and if they did they would go out of business. I mean I would love trade my RT-AC66R for new hardware or my NG R7000 or my R7800 for the XR500 but that logic is just plain silly!

 

As of right now I see Netduma doing one of two things in the future, release a new more powerful router with their Duma OS on it or just continue to license it out and support the R1 for as long as they can.  If I were in charge at Netduma I would pick which ever one makes me the most money.  

 

At the end of the day they are not screwing their customer base, the only gripe I have is I wish they handled the delay in the Duma OS differently!

 

 

There really should be some sort of discount offered to those who have the R1. I completely agree, but am rather doubtful it will ever happen. It would be a way to amend...

 

See above reply!

 

We are separate companies. They would not give someone a discount to a customer who bought a product from an entirely different company.

 

 

 

I think people are failing to see how licensing really works....

[Od1n]

for those with an R1 wondering if its worth to upgrade, why it took so long to develop DumaOS and why some of the previously advertised features are still missing

 

 

We noticed that continually adding features to the r1 was becoming difficult because the new feature often broke an existing one. Because it wasn't designed from start with expansion in mind.

DumaOS has been. It is seriously simple to add new features which we will be doing from now on. Polygons, dampening (anti-jitter), etc there all coming. It's a piece of cake to achieve with DumaOS.

Btw it also has a bunch of other features. Full blown hardware acceleration meaning no software jitter at all. Automatic anti-bufferbloat. Far more advanced DPI, can classify and priotise far more games and non gaming traffic. Fully modular UI allowing all your favourite features to be accessed simultaneously on the dashboard, etc, etc

[RunningOnEmpty]

I don't recall any router having this sort of feature.  I do think it would be a cool feature but at the same time, if you can not trust or control your kids then that is a parenting issue.  My son plays Xbox and I showed him how to use the geo filter and he knows if he screws with any other settings he won't be playing Xbox anymore!  As for room mates, just turn off the Geo filter when they play, however what kind of room mates would they be if they screwed with your settings to mess with you or anyone?  Sounds like you (general you) would just need a new room mate.  This should not be listed as "bad" but as a requested feature in the future IMHO.

 

Scott, is that you? You sound like him and have an amazing knowledge of how my home is run, but Scott would know that my children loved to swing from the chandeliers until I cut them down (first the chandeliers and then the children.) He would also know that my roommates are usually too busy huffing paint to worry about router settings, which I suspect you may have some familiarity with.

 

No router, other than the XR500, has the DumaOS and so I wouldn't expect that any other router would have these features. Many use the R1 as a gaming router and have a second router for their network. The XR500 would, more likely, be used as the main router for a home network. The R1 didn't even have the ability to be password protected until recently and so using the IP address for the router gave access to the gaming information. Because the setup menu wasn't designed for the average user on the R1 it wasn't much of an issue for most, but that's not the case with the XR500.

 

(edit) The DumaOS gives access to many of the networks settings on the same page as where one would see the gaming information via the Dashboard, where the current software does not.(edit)

 

Sounds like you (specifically you) would just need a better understanding of what a review is meant to do before commenting. It's not only about how I would use the product, but about how the product would be expected to be used by the majority.

 

Everything would have been fine for me had the VPN client allowed for more than one specific VPN to be used. Additionally, for me, there are better routers with the same price-point that can be used that allow for all of the functionality that I need in a router; especially with the ability to flash custom firmware. Since I have the R1, I will have use of the NetDuma software and be able to customize my router for my home network as I see fit.

 

My opinion is that those who currently own the R1 would be better off buying another router and let the R1 handle their NetDuma needs. But opinions are like Scotts, everybody has one.

[XSXS]

Scott, is that you? You sound like him and have an amazing knowledge of how my home is run, but Scott would know that my children loved to swing from the chandeliers until I cut them down (first the chandeliers and then the children.) He would also know that my roommates are usually too busy huffing paint to worry about router settings, which I suspect you may have some familiarity with.

 

No router, other than the XR500, has the DumaOS and so I wouldn't expect that any other router would have these features. Many use the R1 as a gaming router and have a second router for their network. The XR500 would, more likely, be used as the main router for a home network. The R1 didn't even have the ability to be password protected until recently and so using the IP address for the router gave access to the gaming information. Because the setup menu wasn't designed for the average user on the R1 it wasn't much of an issue for most, but that's not the case with the XR500.

 

Sounds like you (specifically you) would just need a better understanding of what a review is meant to do before commenting. It's not only about how I would use the product, but about how the product would be expected to be used by the majority.

 

Everything would have be fine for me had the VPN client allowed for more than one specific VPN to be used. Additionally, for me, there are better routers with the same price-point that can be used that allow for all of the functionality that I need in a router; especially with the ability to flash custom firmware. Since I have the R1, I will have use of the NetDuma software and be able to customize my router for my home network as I see fit.

 

My opinion is that those who currently own the R1 would be better off buying another router and let the R1 handle their NetDuma needs. But opinions are like Scotts, everybody has one.

 

No I am not Scott, lol but maybe you are just a trekie junkie?  Anyway not important, let me tell you specifically how reviews (opinions) online work.  You give yours and other people will share theirs and comment on them. My disagreement with your review is you listed that in the "bad" category where I believe a professional reviewer would have listed that as a feature they would like to have.  

I also think it is a bit premature to give a solid review when the product has only been out a couple of days and tell people it is not worth the upgrade in hardware, even if you were a beta tester for NG.  I mean there is already a firmware update out that will fix some issues.

 

BTW, I do not need to sniff paint to know when someone has no control of their children and/or room mates. I mean just ask your imaginary friend Scott, just saying.....

[RunningOnEmpty]

No I am not Scott, lol but maybe you are just a trekie junkie?  Anyway not important, let me tell you specifically how reviews (opinions) online work.  You give yours and other people will share theirs and comment on them. My disagreement with your review is you listed that in the "bad" category where I believe a professional reviewer would have listed that as a feature they would like to have.  

I also think it is a bit premature to give a solid review when the product has only been out a couple of days and tell people it is not worth the upgrade in hardware, even if you were a beta tester for NG.  I mean there is already a firmware update out that will fix some issues.

 

BTW, I do not need to sniff paint to know when someone has no control of their children and/or room mates. I mean just ask your imaginary friend Scott, just saying.....

 

I gave my review based on my experience and understanding of how the device would likely be used. For the issues that you mentioned with my reviews, pertaining to the actual information I provided, I clarified what and why I said what I said. While I appreciate the kind words, I am not and do not claim to be a professional reviewer.

 

As far as it being premature, I can't comment on what future updates will and won't do and the device is a production device; so I reviewed it. If I were a beta tester then I would inform the company of the issues so that they could fix them prior to production.

 

BTW, after conversing with you I would have to say that you are definitely a Scott. And I'm sure that you don't need to sniff paint, you only do it in social settings.

[XSXS]

Well regardless of this Scott guy, thanks for the review.

Back on topic, the hard ware that Netgear chose to use for the Duma OS is rated #1 for total router on small net builder. It's probably the best consumer router out there.

I think you should give it a couple of weeks before writing it off but that's Scott's opinion.

If the Duma OS lives up to the hype, I think the xr 500 will be a killer router and a must have for gamers with >500Mbps internet plans.

[DanSaturn]

Anybody know where or when you can buy this in the UK? or Europe I guess?

[Netduma Fraser]

Anybody know where or when you can buy this in the UK? or Europe I guess?

 

We found out today that it should be available in the UK in April.

[sitefresh]

NSA wants backdoor access to every router in the world.   all your doing is partnering with them for the most part.

 

guessing they paid you a lot...

[Netduma Fraser]

NSA wants backdoor access to every router in the world.   all your doing is partnering with them for the most part.

 

guessing they paid you a lot...

 

Lol great conspiracy theory!

[sitefresh]

feel free to delete.  

[sidestep6]

Thanks Bags for quoting Iain, I'll paste the rest of what he said in another topic that people will find interesting.

 

 

 

I can clear up a few things. The delay for Nighthawk(NH) availability outside of the US is due to NETGEARs distribution system. It just takes longer to reach different centres and channels, I don't know the details but that is the main reason. Also we need to fully integrate language translation into NH which we're doing at the moment. I know UK speaks English obiviousy but NG distributes in terms of regions. So UK is part of EU. To distribute to EU you need language translation for many countries.

 

DumaOS is not delayed on the R1 by NG. They have no such control over what we do with our own hardware and when we do it. We are partners with NG, we do not work for them, cannot state that more clearly. R1 is delayed due to hardware challenges we're solving at the moment namely automatic turbo mode(fastpath) which is required by DumaOS (user doesn't have to fiddle with UI to get max speeds) and finally how configurations are partitioned (hopefully making DumaOS unbrickable).

 

Finally our hardware will have more features because we will create experimental features based on our roadmap and community feedback. Only when NG approves of a new feature will it go on their router. So likely the NG will slightly behind our hardware in terms of bleeding edge features. Which for the typical consumer is ideal as they don't want to test out stuff that may not be useful or is complicated. But if you're that way inclined then enjoy the experience with our hardware.

 

 

Oh so the XR500 will get the Anti-Jitter/Anti-Spike feature it just doesn't get it at launch, good to know.

[titofuenla]

Oh so the XR500 will get the Anti-Jitter/Anti-Spike feature it just doesn't get it at launch, good to know.

At no time is it guaranteed that it will be for Netgear, what Ián says is that if netgear approves that it is in its software, it will be yes or no, something that is not safe

[fuzzy clam]

Oh so the XR500 will get the Anti-Jitter/Anti-Spike feature it just doesn't get it at launch, good to know.

Nothing is for sure on what features the XR500 will get, that's something that will be worked out between Netgear and Netduma.

 

I don't have any "inside information" on the subject but don't want anyone to purchase a product under the assumption that it will have features that it might not.

 

Just throwing it out there,I'm sure as new features are released we'll be updated on what's going on with the XR500 and it's SW and FW.

[sidestep6]

At no time is it guaranteed that it will be for Netgear, what Ián says is that if netgear approves that it is in its software, it will be yes or no, something that is not safe

 

 

Nothing is for sure on what features the XR500 will get, that's something that will be worked out between Netgear and Netduma.

 

I don't have any "inside information" on the subject but don't want anyone to purchase a product under the assumption that it will have features that it might not.

 

Just throwing it out there,I'm sure as new features are released we'll be updated on what's going on with the XR500 and it's SW and FW.

 

 

I have not seen Iain or Fraser say that the Anti-Jitter/Anti-Spike feature is exclusive to the R1 yet people on here seem to have concluded that is the case ( see quoted posts below ). Just pointing out that the statements from the Netduma staff have been vague and in no way indicate exclusivity. I'm not suggesting anyone buy anything but based on what has been said in this thread people reading it would get inaccurate information based on users making their own assumptions.

 

 

I love that the Jitter spike is R1 exclusive that means I don't have to purchase the Netgear router.  Congratulations on the partnership.

 

 

Netduma decided to keep this feature for the R1.  They can't give all the toys to Netgear...LOL

 

 

No anti-jitter on the NetGear XR500? Ok time to take my trusty R1 off of Craigslist then!  Congratulations with the NetGear partnership fellas, I'm glad other routers are recognizing how great your software really is! One more question before completely throwing away the idea of buying an XR500; will the Netgear XR500 have r-apps? 

 

 

You are correct. The current R1 is not running the latest DumaOS. What I’m saying is that once the latest DumaOS is released for the R1, it will be very similar to what is on the Netgear now. The R1 will have the “anti-jitter/anti-ping” as the Netgear will not. The only thing I see that the R1 can’t offer is better WiFi and that just due to the limitations of the current R1 hardware. Just remember now, when Netduma first came out, the whole intention was to release a device that can help gamers with their lag/ping and geo-location as to how we connect to people around the world. At the time, the hardware they chose was sufficient as to what they were trying to accomplish. Fast forward to now...the R1 still works and runs stable, but it just needed better WiFi....and now it does! I’m pretty sure eventually the R1 hardware will be update (I think) but only the Netduma clan knows this answer!

 

 

Well this changes everything. No Anti-Jitter/Anti-Spike features on the Netgear.

 

I was interested on the Netgear because of the CPU being superior so that it could maintain higher VPN speeds but with those lack of features it's best to stay with the R1.

 

I guess the only thing to be seen is if the Netgear down the road will be getting Anti-Jitter/Anti-Spike features or not.

 

Congrats to NetDuma for you partnership.

 

 

Congratulations boys! It's been a rough last year or so traversing the salty waters of these forum and I'm really pleased with this development from a business perspective as it means a much more secure revenue stream to grow your team and your product 

 

As an existing R1 owner, I'm really happy to see that we will receive DumaOS as promised rather than needing to upgrade the hardware (though solid for wired connections is pretty dated) and that we have a street date for the software launch.

 

I want some of the new router's wireless features for the kiddly-winks and mobile devices, so this is a no-brainer purchase for me. The only concern is anti-jitter and anti-spike absent on the Netgear...looks like I'll keep the R1 for my gear and the Netgear to cover wireless.

 

More than anything, I'm glad to see DumaOS isn't dead and that there's a legitimate reason behind the extended silence. I'd rather envision Iain with his head down and arse up tinkering with a Netgear router than lounging on a couch flipping the R1 over in his hands imagining what could have been...

[titofuenla]

I have not seen Iain or Fraser say that the Anti-Jitter/Anti-Spike feature is exclusive to the R1 yet people on here seem to have concluded that is the case ( see quoted posts below ). Just pointing out that the statements from the Netduma staff have been vague and in no way indicate exclusivity. I'm not suggesting anyone buy anything but based on what has been said in this thread people reading it would get inaccurate information based on users making their own assumptions.

I never said that it was something exclusive of the R1, I simply commented that Iain said that it would depend on Netgear if they wanted to include that option or not.

Although really if you could say that right now it is something exclusive that only the R1 will have, at least until netgear gives the go-ahead and wants to include it.

[Red]

Congratulations, on the partnership and DumaOS Iain. I would've been happier if you had released it to the R1 first as we were the early adopters that waited for 2 years but I guess the money was too good.

 

How does updating work for the XR500? Is it the same process as the R1? Download a file off forums and update?

[Netduma Fraser]

Yeah there is that option, can download off the NG website then update. It also has auto update and will show up on the interface of an update is available.

[Red]

Yeah there is that option, can download off the NG website then update. It also has auto update and will show up on the interface of an update is available.

Can you speak about the future for the XR500 and how they will adopt newer features such as anti-spike or anti-jitter? Does the partnership not cover 'newer' features or will this ultimately be decided by NG? It seems like a reskin.

[Netduma Fraser]

Features like that will be a decision by them if they want to adopt it. Some features we’ll be including in the coming updates will be auto ping on dashboard, ping assist, peer ping etc. It’s definitely not a reskin.