Bufferbloat without qos

[Sunaikinti]

I'd like to use the anti bufferbloat without having to use qos. Like an overall bandwidth limiter.

[bbursley]

Couldn't you just turn anti-bb off? Or does that turn the whole thing off? But bandwidth limiting IS a QOS function. 

[Sunaikinti]

I just want to use anti bufferbloat without using qos. Have enough speed for everything except when someone is downloading and maxes it out. Like limit the download a bit and not limit on the upload and no qos. Separate the anti bufferbloat from the qos is what I mean. Anti bufferbloat doesn't work without qos enabled. 

[BIG__DOG]

Anti bufferbloat is another name for QOS, they are 1 and the same, not separate entities.  Bufferbloat is caused by your network, not by any external force. 

I think if you click the "disable QOS" tick box then anti bufferbloat should be greyed out to avoid this confusion unless it is ticked again!

[bbursley]

2 hours ago, Sunaikinti said:

I just want to use anti bufferbloat without using qos. Have enough speed for everything except when someone is downloading and maxes it out. Like limit the download a bit and not limit on the upload and no qos. Separate the anti bufferbloat from the qos is what I mean. Anti bufferbloat doesn't work without qos enabled. 

Technically according to the way networking logic works, you cant really even prioritization download, you can really only prioritize upload. You really shouldnt have any issues if you have share excess enabled, and if you do you can always add more to whatever device you wish so as to eliminate the worry of one device taking it all, or untick share excess but then all devices will equally be distributed bandwidth without having access to more. limiting download and upload is part of what the anti bufferbloat is. Now I can understand kinda what your saying is to not have the actual antibufferbloat algorithm in place. idk if that makes sense to do though. usually with most newer QOS theres always some algorithm it follows. Older QOS worked off rate limiting but thats not really seen by itself as much anymore. I have had routers that did what you mean though, just rate limit and nothing else. But tbh those sucked in comparison.

[Sunaikinti]

Or just revamp qos so you can set bandwidth limits and priorities per device. That would be sweet!

[Netduma Fraser]

I'm kind of confused by your question. You can use Anti-Bufferbloat on its own if you want, just leave everything else as standard (a lot of people do this), it is QoS though.

On 3/30/2019 at 10:56 PM, Sunaikinti said:

Or just revamp qos so you can set bandwidth limits and priorities per device. That would be sweet!

That's what Bandwidth Allocation and Traffic Prioritization does (though we don't recommend prioritizing anything other than low bandwidth traffic.

[Sunaikinti]

Just bought a s8000 switch so I can do exactly what I wanted. Prioritize and limit bandwidth per device. I'll still use the geo filter on the xr500, just not the qos. Also turned off the wireless on the xr500 and set up an AP. This way I can control that too. Gaming on high, stream medium, the rest on low. Still confused?

[Netduma Fraser]

I am still confused as you've bought another device to essentially use QoS and do what the XR500 already does. If that works for you then great!

[bbursley]

On 4/2/2019 at 2:48 PM, Sunaikinti said:

Just bought a s8000 switch so I can do exactly what I wanted. Prioritize and limit bandwidth per device. I'll still use the geo filter on the xr500, just not the qos. Also turned off the wireless on the xr500 and set up an AP. This way I can control that too. Gaming on high, stream medium, the rest on low. Still confused?

So then turn bufferbloat off (not Qos) then turn off sharing excess data, then you can place your console in the priority section as usual. On the flower you can manually set speeds for everyone or you can leave share excess and just set the speeds you want certain devices to be guaranteed. The only other thing you MIGHT be able to do is enter speeds lower than what you have in the section where it asks for it, though I’ve tried as you mentioned and I found that with sliders at 100/100 and speeds set at lower I still obtained full speeds anyways. But I guess if the switch does what you want then I guess that works too. Perhaps something down the road will get implemented. But bandwidth limiting really isn’t all that great by itself, which is why you’d still need the console in priority. Not sure if that will prevent those Devices from facing bufferbloat exclusively or not just because they are prioritized. That’s a question for the team I suppose, but I’m willing to bet without some limiting involved you’ll max the connection potentially unless you have a ridiculous speed. 

[Zippy]

21 minutes ago, bbursley said:

So then turn bufferbloat off (not Qos) then turn off sharing excess data, then you can place your console in the priority section as usual. On the flower you can manually set speeds for everyone or you can leave share excess and just set the speeds you want certain devices to be guaranteed. The only other thing you MIGHT be able to do is enter speeds lower than what you have in the section where it asks for it, though I’ve tried as you mentioned and I found that with sliders at 100/100 and speeds set at lower I still obtained full speeds anyways. But I guess if the switch does what you want then I guess that works too. Perhaps something down the road will get implemented. But bandwidth limiting really isn’t all that great by itself, which is why you’d still need the console in priority. Not sure if that will prevent those Devices from facing bufferbloat exclusively or not just because they are prioritized. That’s a question for the team I suppose, but I’m willing to bet without some limiting involved you’ll max the connection potentially unless you have a ridiculous speed. 

Ive seen a few do what Sunaikinti has done and get much better results.. I also think that S8000 switch does work off of a form of fq codel..  Not to mention it works well with cable type providers.. The XR500 seems to struggle atm to do everything. Id almost bet that he likely will see better gaming performance.. Which is the key factor.. One thing I personally have noticed is a switch keeps the connection quality in tack.  Im also one that doesn't believe in the 70/70 rule to set ones sliders at.. That's just to harsh on a cable provider network. Its all about implementation.. The XR500 isn't there yet.. 

Zippy.

[Netduma Fraser]

70/70 is only a starting point, we always recommend you experiment with these values as it is different for every connection. If you have to throttle a lot to get a good connection then you can just set this to when high priority traffic detected so it doesn't affect you when not gaming. If everything is connected to the router and you've got the perfect settings for your specific connection you should not notice any latency issues when the network is saturated.