Connection dropping,

[Gunganator]

I was just about to post my issue, similar to another post by David. You just saved me the trouble and Opened up a bigger question.
 

 On 7/6/2021 at 3:53 PM, Netduma Fraser said:

It could be the warmth, if you elevate it so it has plenty of airflow does the issues reduce?

 

20 hours ago, Netduma Liam said:

Sorry to hear that, did the R2 still feel abnormally hot despite being elevated?

It's strange that you're still able to access the interface when connected via Wi-Fi, when you do this, does the R2 have a WAN IP in System information -> Network Status?

Could you please capture a log while the R2 is still down (assuming you can still access the interface) and send it over?

 

Hang on there, I thought this was an issue only I was suffering from. So what we have here is acknowledgement from Technical support staff there is heat issue and design flaw in the R2. 

To offer a work around means you are aware of the problem, that also means you have had many incidents reported to require the potential problem be raised and a workaround to be created.

So my question is this? What is the fix to the problem going to be?  Can we get any details and a time line?

Or do we All just use this evidence to return for full refund as you have just admitted there is a problem with the devices design and heat?

I.E. Not fit for purpose under the consumer rights act. 

By the way. The green section no longer applies, you guys have just fulfilled the red section yourselves. Thank you.

If a fault develops after the first six months, the burden is on you to prove that the product was faulty at the time you took ownership of it. 

In practice, this may require some form of expert report, opinion or evidence of similar problems across the product range

[Roy_B]

Mine arrived yesterday as just dropped the connection 2 times already and just used on wired mode for the clients only admin purposes via WiFi...

[Netduma Liam]

Hey @Gunganator, sorry to hear that you are experiencing this issue.

You're absolutely right, we're aware of this issue and have been working diligently ever since we first noticed it to identify the root cause of it. The reason it's taken this long so far is because it's a very difficult issue to diagnose and we're not sure if it's genuinely a hardware fault because there's only a small percentage of users with this issue relative to the amount of people that use an R2.

That being said, we've actually been making great progress working closely with a couple of users that experience it and are hopeful we'll be able to provide a full fix to the issue, not a workaround. It's hard to provide a timeline currently as there are still more steps to the process, sorry about that. If elevating the R2 has stopped the disconnections for you, please use this as a temporary fix until we can provide a more permanent one.

However, if you'd like to pursue a refund for your R2, you can send an email over to [email protected] and we'd be happy to start that process for you.

If you have any further questions or concerns, please do let me know.

30 minutes ago, Roy_B said:

Mine arrived yesterday as just dropped the connection 2 times already and just used on wired mode for the clients only admin purposes via WiFi...

Welcome to the forum! Please see the above, but also if you'd like to troubleshoot this further with us could you please create a new topic and we can dig into this issue with you further? 

[Roy_B]

13 minutes ago, Netduma Liam said:

Hey @Gunganator, sorry to hear that you are experiencing this issue.

You're absolutely right, we're aware of this issue and have been working diligently ever since we first noticed it to identify the root cause of it. The reason it's taken this long so far is because it's a very difficult issue to diagnose and we're not sure if it's genuinely a hardware fault because there's only a small percentage of users with this issue relative to the amount of people that use an R2.

That being said, we've actually been making great progress working closely with a couple of users that experience it and are hopeful we'll be able to provide a full fix to the issue, not a workaround. It's hard to provide a timeline currently as there are still more steps to the process, sorry about that. If elevating the R2 has stopped the disconnections for you, please use this as a temporary fix until we can provide a more permanent one.

However, if you'd like to pursue a refund for your R2, you can send an email over to [email protected] and we'd be happy to start that process for you.

If you have any further questions or concerns, please do let me know.

Welcome to the forum! Please see the above, but also if you'd like to troubleshoot this further with us could you please create a new topic and we can dig into this issue with you further? 

Thank you Liam. I will start the refund process as I doing troubleshooting IRL as well and tired to investigating these things on my spare time too. Appreciated. 

[Gunganator]

Ok, so let me get this straight, you are trying to resolve a physical fault with a software solution? correct me if I read that wrong, but that is how it seems.

It is quite simple, redesign the current device to have a little more ventilation possibly even a small fan to help circulate the air. Definitely increase the height form the base of the unit and the surface it sits on. 

there is also scope to prevent returns of current devices with a free stand to provide more clearance and maybe even incorporate a small fan powered from USB. Yeah this may cost a £ per unit to produce and send out for each device that has been sold.

Now the question is, are you going to deal with the complaints, and refund those and hope that the cost of this is less than the cost of a redesign - retooling and sending out a fix to existing customers?

Or are you going to fix the issue going forward and resolve it for current owners?

 

 

[Gunganator]

Quote

The reason it's taken this long so far is because it's a very difficult issue to diagnose and we're not sure if it's genuinely a hardware fault because there's only a small percentage of users with this issue relative to the amount of people that use an R2.

Sorry but that one there is a corporate line if ever I heard one.

Wonder how many hotpoint users complained about their washing machine setting their house on fire compared to units sold.

Not quite comparable I know, but the point still stands. how many users will know this is a fault and raise it compared to those that just do what their ISP has brainwashed them into doing for decades. reboot the device and it'll work (because it cools down) because they have been providing janky cheap lowest bidder created crap forever.

Also here is a really good point, the ventilation of the R2 is all on the base.... said base has a 4mm clearance from a surface, depending on the surface that could also be reflecting heat back at the base. 

Heat if I am correct rises, where exactly does that heat escape to? 

I'll tell you where, the pocket of thick dark plastic on top of the router, that has no escape......... if it can't escape and dissipate upwards, it is then not causing the cooler air to be sucked in through the base using a vacuum effect. 

I think we have found the design flaw ladies and gentlemen.
 

[Netduma Liam]

The truth is that we do not know if it's a hardware fault, we've seen users having disconnections without abnormal amounts of heat, as well as other symptoms. We've also seen cases where we've troubleshooted the issue with a user and solved it, but then the same solution doesn't work for a different user. For some users, elevating the R2 has helped, where in other cases it's made no difference. That's why it's such a complicated problem and hence the time it's taken for us to investigate it.

I don't mean to sound like I'm giving corporate responses, we always try to be as transparent as possible so apologies if that's how I came across there.

We can, will and have provided refunds or replacements to users that experience issues, it's our problem to solve and we know that. If that's how you'd like to proceed please do send me an email and we can do this.

Apologies once again for any inconvenience or frustration caused, please do give me a shout if you have any further questions.

[P8rioticDissent]

Here is a fun question…why is this still being sold if so many people are suffering from this engineering flaw? Fix it. Make sure it works. THEN sell something. Your customers should not be unknowing beta testers. If these are continuing to be sold, there should be a disclaimer on the website and the box that your router may not work as desired and if it doesn’t “we are working on it”. It’s bad business 

[Netduma Fraser]

18 minutes ago, P8rioticDissent said:

Here is a fun question…why is this still being sold if so many people are suffering from this engineering flaw? Fix it. Make sure it works. THEN sell something. Your customers should not be unknowing beta testers. If these are continuing to be sold, there should be a disclaimer on the website and the box that your router may not work as desired and if it doesn’t “we are working on it”. It’s bad business 

Liam was referring to the disconnection issue rather than there being an overheating issue - we're currently fixing the disconnection issue - not everyone has this. There is only one user that seems to have definitely proved that his specific router was overheating causing his disconnection problem

[P8rioticDissent]

1 hour ago, Netduma Fraser said:

Liam was referring to the disconnection issue rather than there being an overheating issue - we're currently fixing the disconnection issue - not everyone has this. There is only one user that seems to have definitely proved that his specific router was overheating causing his disconnection problem

Ok. If it isn’t a hardware engineering issue, it’s a software issue, and it’s not an uncommon one. This is a beta issue on a retail product. Seems to me to be an unhealthy way to do business. I know it left me with a bad taste in my mouth, and I’m sure I’m not alone. Have you guys tried testing your own product instead of having customers troubleshoot and post logs on the forums, essentially beta testing for you?

[Netduma Fraser]

33 minutes ago, P8rioticDissent said:

Ok. If it isn’t a hardware engineering issue, it’s a software issue, and it’s not an uncommon one. This is a beta issue on a retail product. Seems to me to be an unhealthy way to do business. I know it left me with a bad taste in my mouth, and I’m sure I’m not alone. Have you guys tried testing your own product instead of having customers troubleshoot and post logs on the forums, essentially beta testing for you?

It is a support forum so all you will see here are people having issues or asking questions, you won't see all the customers who aren't posting/having issues which is the majority. We do of course test our own updates, however, testing it in a lab basis or even with a beta group will never uncover every bug. As with any software bugs will happen and updates will fix them, even the games you play, every update has bug fixes.