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SlowFoShow

I had a feeling that there were going to be issues and there are.

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Hi there, 

 

as you know I recently received my r2 modem, the modem is placed closer than my bt home hub modem yet i get very different speedtest results, qos is switched off and nothing is prioritised. I have updated to the latest version and did a factory reset, hardwired its getting 800mb which i expect due to using wifi, normally with BT i get around 400 in wifi but its now a bit further away so the signal is lower but still getting more than the r2. please advise or I may have to reconsider this modem, the difference is far too high considering the bt modem is underperforming by 200mb than it is capable of here in these results. 

 

BT.png

netduma.png

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The WiFi speeds/range is something we are actively working to improve at the moment. Have you disabled mirror mode, given 2.4GHz & 5GHz different names and saved, then connected to 5GHz for the test? 

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Are you still using the BT WiFi as well as the R2 WiFi? If so what channels are they both using on both 2.4 and 5Ghz?
What bandwidths have you set for both 2.4 and 5Ghz?

Theres an app called WiFi Sweetspots, this can test the throughput internally, it’s worth using this but it is device dependant bit will show the throughput. 

Make sure the R2 is away from other electrical devices and positioned in a nice open space, not behind monitors, next to land lines, fans and so on and not placed on the floor.

Ive seen the throughput around 400mbps which is on par for the spec of the router however you need to insure other neighbouring channels are not an issue.

What model is your BT hub? 

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The BT WiFi is off. It's the latest smart hub AC2600. Wired I'm getting around 900 from the R2 it's just the wifi. The internet keeps dropping too, WiFi remains on but no connection either wired or on WiFi but can still access dumaos, this has happened 3 times in the last hour requiring a reboot.

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i also keep getting this in the logs Tue Jan  5 21:56:55 2021 daemon.warn odhcpd[1371]: A default route is present but there is no public prefix on lan thus we don't announce a default route!

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Have you disabled mirror mode, given 2.4GHz & 5GHz different names and saved, then connected to 5GHz for the test? Use a WiFi analyzer and find the least congested channels and change to those. Experiment with the widths and in DHCP lease settings change hours to 168.

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How do I disable mirror mode? How do I change the names? And is the WiFi analyser just an app for pc? Already changed the lease to 168. Cheers.

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9 hours ago, Netduma Fraser said:

You can do that from Settings > WiFi, let us know how you get on. There is a free WiFi analyzer app on the Microsoft Store on Windows that is quite good.

tried the channels on the wifi analyser and it didn't really help, I did have my phone right next to the R2 this morning and it maxed at 200, also tested the same with BT and I got 380 so there is a definite difference between the wifi capabilities of the BT Smarthub 2 and the Netduma R2.

I would also like to say that right after set up I get speeds of around 140 to the PC that I want to use for gaming which is good enough as I mainly require the use of the OS and speeds of 140 down and 110 up with low ping are more than enough.

However, I figured out yesterday that if I make any changed to the router that require me to hit save, that is when I start getting the really low speeds from the wifi, if the only changes I make are to the geofencing then there is no problem, but as soon as I make a change to anything else and hit save, my speeds are halved until I do a full restart and setup of the router, sometimes the 5hz will stop working or will just drop to speeds of 25 to 30 on both frequencies. 

So for now, as myself, partner and son have to WFH I have had to re-enable the BT wifi as it is far more reliable, faster and never drops connection and when I am gaming I will use the Netduma as the speeds I get still give me the advantage of the geofencing which is what I needed.

Its a shame as I was imagining being able to set it up for everyone to use and not think about it anymore, the price is a bit steep for something I will only use for a couple of hours a day but there's not much I can do. I have fttp on a new build flat and BT decided to hang up their monster of a modem inside a small cupboard near the kitchen, the Smarthub 2 connects to their fttp modem also inside the cabinet which now connects to the R2, wired is not really an option as the cable would have to run across the kitchen to the office. Oh yes I also connected the R2 directly to the fttp modem, same performance but without the Smarthub 2 as a backup so not reliable, the issue here is the Wifi as a wired connection gets me 900 down from the R2. 

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And here are the tests I did this morning, Netduma router is actually closer than the BT homehub as i managed to place it outside the cupboard on top of a side table. BT - D=358.92 U=117.37 Netduma R2 - D=131.62 U=86.37

BT.png

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That’s a bad position to place the ONT and no router will like being placed in a cupboard let alone a kitchen. 

To be honest the BT WiFi is pretty awful too if you have a gig and only get 400 but there is some dependency on the device too but the 5Ghz on the BT hub has a max rate of 1733. The R2 has a max rate of 866. Both of these are on 5Ghz and you will never see those results.
There is also other differences in the standard of WiFi but positioning of a router is critical and a cupboard or a kitchen that has all that EMI is going to impact performance. 
in the R2 WiFi settings you need to turn of mirror mode as you could be connecting to 2.4 which has a lower throughput. You need as Fraser noted to rename both channels and this allows you to connect to the appropriate channel to test.

if I’m honest unless you can move those routers out of the kitchen and definitely out of a cupboard sorting the WiFi is going to be hard work. Every electrical device from fridge, freezer, lights, extraction fan, kettle, cooker, microwave will be creating interference. 

 

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12 minutes ago, Newfie said:

That’s a bad position to place the ONT and no router will like being placed in a cupboard let alone a kitchen. 

To be honest the BT WiFi is pretty awful too if you have a gig and only get 400 but there is some dependency on the device too but the 5Ghz on the BT hub has a max rate of 1733. The R2 has a max rate of 866. Both of these are on 5Ghz and you will never see those results.
There is also other differences in the standard of WiFi but positioning of a router is critical and a cupboard or a kitchen that has all that EMI is going to impact performance. 
in the R2 WiFi settings you need to turn of mirror mode as you could be connecting to 2.4 which has a lower throughput. You need as Fraser noted to rename both channels and this allows you to connect to the appropriate channel to test.

if I’m honest unless you can move those routers out of the kitchen and definitely out of a cupboard sorting the WiFi permanent is going to be hard work. 
 

Its not possible for the fttp modem as its all hard wired through the wall, and screwed on, its a monster of a modem, somehow Openreach thought that it would be a good idea to put it inside an airing cupboard.

I have already separated the frequencies, the 5Ghz is getting the speeds that I posted above and the 2Ghz is getting around 75 to 80 down.

Also changed the channels using the analyser but the main problem is as I said above, if I press save on anything to do with Wifi, it drops the connection to half or even drops the 5Ghz altogether forcing me to do a full reset and new setup to get the original speeds back.

For gaming I am totally ok with those speeds, so in a way its doing what I need it to do, gaming doesn't require a massive upload and download, its more about who I am connecting to etc, unfortunately I wont be able to use all of the features available in the netduma os as they require hitting that dreaded save button, the Geo features work and that is mainly what I was after.

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Airing cupboard, is the boiler in there too? Really not a good place. Edit to say, they installed it near the main fuse box too so your router was also close to that.
problem is while you can live with those speeds the interference will have an impact on it. Throughput is only part of the story and in simple terms you will get errors as your WiFi flys around. Channel utilisation springs to mind and while you can see a throughput if channel utilisation is high it brings a heap of issues.

Wifi is the weak point of most routers, as progression has moved forward ie, wave 1, wave 2 plus WiFi 4, WiFi 5 and now WiFi 6 we see improvements along with the hardware spec of a router. 
Fraser needs to help on the issue with saving but I don’t suffer that issue when I test my R2.

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36 minutes ago, Newfie said:

Airing cupboard, is the boiler in there too? Really not a good place. Edit to say, they installed it near the main fuse box too so your router was also close to that.
problem is while you can live with those speeds the interference will have an impact on it. Throughput is only part of the story and in simple terms you will get errors as your WiFi flys around. Channel utilisation springs to mind and while you can see a throughput if channel utilisation is high it brings a heap of issues.

Wifi is the weak point of most routers, as progression has moved forward ie, wave 1, wave 2 plus WiFi 4, WiFi 5 and now WiFi 6 we see improvements along with the hardware spec of a router. 
Fraser needs to help on the issue with saving but I don’t suffer that issue when I test my R2.

There is no boiler in there, I have a gas boiler in the kitchen, the wifi signal is pretty solid despite its low speeds, I get a smooth gaming experience, I was monitoring the connection while playing a match and it remained low ping/ms throughout which is fine, and at least I can target low ping servers that are near me which is more than the BT Smarthub will do. 

I do have wall plugs however they are 500s and with my wiring I am getting around 80 down on the plugs, not really sure if there is a way of improving it without hard wiring across the floor. Is Mesh any good?

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34 minutes ago, SlowFoShow said:

Its a medium sized 2 bedroom flat.

As the BT home hub covers your property I don’t think mesh would be worth it and with some mesh setups they require a distance from each node or Access point. 
I don’t think the home hub allows it as an Access point as that would then handle the WiFi, you could check to see if it does but I’m fairly sure it does not.

With routers it’s best to pick one that suits your needs so maybe one of the XR routers would have been a good choice as they do offer better WiFi but of course it’s a step up in price. 
 

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Thanks for all the information. I do apologize for your experience so far, rest assured we are working on WiFi to improve upon this as much as possible.

Regarding the saving issue, what web browser/device are you using to make these changes? Could you provide an example of a setting you change that causes the issue?

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Hi @Netduma Fraser for example when I remove the mirror, it affects both frequencies, its slows down to about 25 each, then if I reenable the mirror it does not recover, rebooting etc wont help, only resetting the router brings it back to its original speeds. 

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Regardless those speeds are good enough for gaming, im getting roughly 130 down and 90 up with 5 ping from the netduma. I just need to use the geofence so im all good. 

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20 minutes ago, SlowFoShow said:

Hi @Netduma Fraser for example when I remove the mirror, it affects both frequencies, its slows down to about 25 each, then if I reenable the mirror it does not recover, rebooting etc wont help, only resetting the router brings it back to its original speeds. 

16 minutes ago, SlowFoShow said:

Regardless those speeds are good enough for gaming, im getting roughly 130 down and 90 up with 5 ping from the netduma. I just need to use the geofence so im all good. 

We are aware of some weird issues with wireless settings so we'll sort that out. If you change QoS settings etc does that save properly? Is it just the WiFi settings? Okay that's good to hear, do keep an eye out for the next firmware and hopefully this will be improved.

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32 minutes ago, Netduma Fraser said:

We are aware of some weird issues with wireless settings so we'll sort that out. If you change QoS settings etc does that save properly? Is it just the WiFi settings? Okay that's good to hear, do keep an eye out for the next firmware and hopefully this will be improved.

Disabling and Enabling can cause the same issue that I have with the QoS so now I just leave it on default, happy to know that you guys are working on fixes for wifi, seems a bit odd the current issues with it. 

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Okay thank you, it must be to do with the wifi issues rather than a problem with saving across the board. We will look into it, thank you for your patience and the information you've provided.

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