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Netduma Luke

R1 DumaOS Briefly Delayed

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We already paid $200.00 for the R1 and its supposed to get the DumaOS for free....So why spend another $300.00 just for the DumaOS?  That is really what your paying for is the DumaOS the specs you can find other routers with better specs for cheaper.  So in the end $500.00 for the NetDuma software and DumaOS is a bit crazy.  Unless you have money and enjoy paying for the same thing twice or 3 times.

It is an issue when said update remains vapourware after 2 years with little in the way of information or support. There's nothing entitled about expressing disappointment that a promise has not been delivered and a deadline has been missed with no follow-up.

 

Honestly, I'm thrilled with the Netgear partnership because on top of the vastly superior hardware and AC wireless / WPS support, the XR500 router has back-end configuration options like a DMZ and internal / external port mapping typically found on other routers but absent from the R1. So a big tick there.

 

I've just unboxed the XR500 10 minutes ago, plugged it in, logged into the backend, changed my LAN back to 192.168.88.X, renamed the SSID and boom...my network of close to 80 devices is back up and running. I was expecting to spend the entire day troubleshooting.

 

DumaOS is gorgeous, I'm really pleased with it and it's easy to see where all of the time and effort over these past two years has gone. Naming the DumaOS release A7Legit is a really nice touch, so kudos to the boys there.

 

But at this stage, I'd rather Netduma come out and say "If you want the full DumaOS experience, upgrade to XR500" than pretend the R1 is going to get anywhere near close to the XR500 experience, if at all possible on the old hardware. At a glance, DumaOS eats too much CPU and RAM to be viable on the R1 without cutting some serious corners.

 

I appreciate that NetDuma is stuck between a rock and a hard place by offering DumaOS support for the R1. I would encourage anyone who can afford to, to simply bypass this mess completely and fork out for an XR500. A token gesture of a discount would help ease the pain and set a positive tone for the future.

 

 If anti-jitter and anti-spike find their way to the XR500, all is forgiven. If I can get colour-coded peers on the Geo-filter and selectively block them based on Ping, I'll be in gaming nirvana!

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The most recent example being yesterday, a guy commented saying after reading the forum comments he’s decided to not buy the R1 until the update situation was resolved. That was it he didn’t swear, nor was he aggressive it was a reasonable post. I come back on this morning and what do you know his comment and 2 other peoples comments have been removed.

 

Either the rules are unclear or somone is abusing his or her power. Why not shed light onto what’s acceptable and what isn’t?

 

The rules are obvious and common sense. If you can't abide by them then you will be removed.

 

Fine, I will explain why the comment that you wanted to quote was removed because you're so unwilling to accept that the moderation was correct.

 

That comment was posted by a known spammer who had created a new account to get around his existing ban from the forum. He created this new account to pretend that he is a potential customer that has been put off by the delay etc, in an attempt to make this thread boil over.

 

I knew that some people would be fooled by this, genuine potential customers could easily have fallen for it, you fell for it.

 

Now you have this information, do you consider it acceptable that I deleted his post and banned his account?

Seeing as it was a fake account, from a banned spammer, trying to stir up discontent in the thread/forum for no purpose other than to be malicious and create problems for the moderators / admin / Netduma, all of which are things that rightly should result in a ban.

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I disagree.

Regardless, I have seen more Mod abuse to those who post in these forums than the reverse.

 

I didn't see in the forum rules that someone couldn't publicly call out a Mod for an action they have taken against them. If a Mods actions were justified there should be nothing to hide. A suspension or a banning is a public action IMO, I dont feel that questioning it publicly is a punishable offense either. There shouldnt be anything to hide.

 

It should be, but it wasn't in my case. I cant see how I got suspended recently. My last post is still up so I cant see how I broke any rules if the post was deemed unacceptable yet I received a ban right after posting none the less. Pretty inconsistent if you ask me.

 

I looked over this before I posted, and it seems to fall within the guidelines of acceptable posts. I am voicing my opinion and explaining why I feel this way. Its my response. It does not accuse any Mod directly of the behavior described above. I believe I can voice my opinion without punishment, which is all Im doing.

 

Of course you don't have to agree with the decision but if a moderator deems that your posting is unacceptable then it is. If you think a mistake was made then send them a polite PM asking for clarification or email Netduma but most of the time it won't have been a mistake. It's pretty obvious what isn't acceptable.

 

No, you haven't, this could be considered trying to stir up anti-moderator feeling (subversion) that could carry a suspension too. Because I don't believe that's what you're trying to do this time, it doesn't need removing.

 

Re. Not discussing a suspension.

It's not that there's something to hide, it's that it's a complete waste of time having to explain it and we shouldn't have to explain it. Every forum ever has had this rule, written or otherwise.

And complaining in here about your suspension stirs the pot, as you can see, one person complains about their suspension (which was fully deserved) then someone else does (even though they know they deserved one too), then I'm having to explain why a known spammer that was pretending to be a new user was banned, then someone else complains about their suspension, etc...

 

You were suspended for disrespect towards moderators and non-constructive posts (trying to stir things up). It's so obvious that both of these might incur a suspension that it shouldn't even need to be specified. Calling out Mods, blaming Mods, trying to undermine Mods, complaining about your suspension/warning, it should be obvious to everybody that you don't do that. If you get a suspension or a warning, you take it on the chin and try harder not to get another.

 

You are correct, this post (yours) is written in an acceptable way but discussing your suspension is not acceptable (and it's off topic). But because my response may help you and others to abide by the rules I will leave it up.

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The rules are obvious and common sense. If you can't abide by them then you will be removed.

 

Fine, I will explain why the comment that you wanted to quote was removed because you're so unwilling to accept that the moderation was correct.

 

That comment was posted by a known spammer who had created a new account to get around his existing ban from the forum. He created this new account and is pretending that he is a potential customer that has been put off by the delay etc. He did this because he is pathetic and has nothing better to do than try to create problems in here.

 

I knew that some people would be fooled by this, genuine potential customers could easily have fallen for it, you fell for it.

 

Now you have this information, do you consider it acceptable that I deleted his post and banned his account?

Seeing as it was a fake account, from a banned spammer, trying to stir up discontent in the thread/forum for no purpose other than to be malicious and create problems for the moderators / admin / Netduma, all of which are things that rightly should result in a ban.

In light of him being a spammer yes that is acceptable, however, if you’re going to remove every comment which may put off potential customers you need to remove thousands of comments and ban 100s of people. I believe as customers we reserve the right to review the product on how we deem fit. Some people like something others don’t that’s life. What’s dangerous is when people with links to the company start muddying the water and removing “legitimate” negative comments about the product in order to boost or maintain sales... That diminishes the credibility of the company and causes doubts about the product.

 

I’ve blasted virgin media and EE for years and not once were my comments removed or hidden.

 

Also naming alternative products to people shouldn’t merit a ban either, I won’t name the router that was mentioned in the removed post but the guy had a point the brand he mentioned does do what he said. Instead of banning people out of fear of losing customers win them back by delivering on promises is what I say but that’s just me.

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In light of him being a spammer yes that is acceptable, however, if you’re going to remove every comment which may put off potential customers you need to remove thousands of comments and ban 100s of people. I believe as customers we reserve the right to review the product on how we deem fit. Some people like something others don’t that’s life. What’s dangerous is when people with links to the company start muddying the water and removing “legitimate” negative comments about the product in order to boost or maintain sales... That diminishes the credibility of the company and causes doubts about the product.

 

I’ve blasted virgin media and EE for years and not once were my comments removed or hidden.

 

Also naming alternative products to people shouldn’t merit a ban either, I won’t name the router that was mentioned in the removed post but the guy had a point the brand he mentioned does do what he said. Instead of banning people out of fear of losing customers win them back by delivering on promises is what I say but that’s just me.

 

I'm clearly not removing every comment like that because this thread would be empty. But this is not the place to leave reviews, this is an announcement thread about the delay, not a 'leave your review' thread.

 

Giving a product a bad review because an update is delayed seems foolish to me anyway. Imagine if Iain looked at this thread tomorrow and just decided f*** it, I'm going to do something else. Imagine if all of the people posting their daily complaint in here actually ended up causing the development of DumaOS on R1 to be abandoned.

 

Would you call that a win? I'd call that shooting myself (and everyone else) in the foot.

 

I would have thought that a post naming alternative products is very likely to be removed, seems like an obvious no-no.

 

I'm a moderator, I moderate the forum, I can't do anything as far as delivering on promises regarding DumaOS goes. The moderators are not the same people that work at Netduma, none of them, they are just customers. By giving the Mods grief about this, you're basically doing the same thing as walking into the Apple store, shouting abuse at the cleaner (an unpaid volunteer cleaner), then demanding she create the new OS that Apple promised. If people give the cleaner grief while they're trying to sweep up the rubbish then security will probably throw you out the door.

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No update yet!!! I see a lot of interesting comments, at least they getting lots of website traffic at a small cost of possible negative comments. I wonder if this is good marketing strategy.

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I disagree. Just because a Mod leaves some posts up that put Netduma and its associates  in a unfavorable light, does not mean some people aren't being suspended for voicing opinions. I saw the forum rules and from what I'm seeing  these guidelines are being used as an excuse to silence those who are the most adamant about being led on about upgrades for R1 that never were fulfilled. I refer to them as broken promises. Regardless, I have seen more Mod abuse to those who post in these forums than the reverse.

 

 

I agree completely with you. Just coming back from a suspension myself, and I still strongly believe that buying a product entitles me to comment on it for better or for worse. And I don't see myself stopping, just because someone is too quick on the banhammer.

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Even if DumaOS hits the R1 (I'll assume in a cut-down form), the reality is you're running very basic, old hardware that is missing rudimentary features like 5Ghz wifi, a strong wifi signal, wireless ac, WPS, guest wifi, DMZ, port mapping, content filtering, DDNS, bridging, traffic monitoring, DLNA, basic NAS capabilities...the list goes on and on.

 

Focusing on software development while hand-balling the ridiculously expensive hardware and marketing side of things to Netgear is a fantastic match for Netduma and I applaud them for the move. I'm sure it was difficult to give up their independence and be perceived as selling out, but we're getting a far better product in return. I'd just like to see a better transition plan for R1 users to the XR500 (and beyond) because you will be left behind, sooner or later with a dated, crappy router chugging along on crippleware.

 

Long story short - DumaOS might drop on the R1 sooner or later, but my guess is it'll be DumaOS Lite. It won't do anything to address the weak aspects of the hardware, nor basic software features you'll find on every other router. Get over it and upgrade to the XR500. Your pockets will be a little lighter and you can still be pissed about a broken promise, but you'll be happier for it.

 

Putting my frustrations as a customer aside, I think this is right on the money. Even if they were to deliver DumaOS for the R1, its is painfully obvious the little guy might not be able to handle it. 

 

But if we figured it out, I still believe the decent thing would be to let us know that, and quit yanking us around with this silence.

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I agree completely with you. Just coming back from a suspension myself, and I still strongly believe that buying a product entitles me to comment on it for better or for worse. And I don't see myself stopping, just because someone is too quick on the banhammer.

From looking at the log why you was suspended (YOU WERE NOT BANNED) by the mod who issued it was was nothing to do with you complaining about the R1 at all.

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I paid $300 AUD for the R1 in March of 2015. I paid a further $380 AUD for the XR500 in May of 2018. I'm happy with both purchases. I've replaced routers on roughly a 3 year basis for two decades, so it's nothing new...everything has an expiration date.

 

The R1 router itself was not impressive - it's a bland, small, beige brick and I would never have bought it for the hardware. I bought it for the software and to support the little guys with the big idea. The time I spent with the R1 for 3 years was worth the money, but the hardware is well and truly out of date and in desperate need of an upgrade.

 

I've wanted a new router for some time, but stuck with the "little box that could", in part due to brand loyalty and in part due to the promise of DumaOS and a couple of features that could further elevate Netduma's status as the leading gaming router software developer. I don't feel that loyalty has been repaid as DumaOS is still MIA on the R1 with no concrete sign that it will happen any time soon. But life goes on and the butthurt will fade over time.

 

Although I am disappointed with how DumaOS has been handled on the R1, I'm very happy that Netduma, a software company, has partnered with arguably the best gaming router hardware brand in the Nighthawk. There's no way that a small indie company could develop hardware in-house to compete with any of the big brands, so it makes perfect sense to focus on their core competency and build DumaOS as robustly as possible. Yes, there is better router hardware out there (not by much), but they can't do what DumaOS does at the same price point, so it's a happy medium that Netduma could never have achieved on their own.

 

Even if DumaOS hits the R1 (I'll assume in a cut-down form), the reality is you're running very basic, old hardware that is missing rudimentary features like 5Ghz wifi, a strong wifi signal, wireless ac, WPS, guest wifi, DMZ, port mapping, content filtering, DDNS, bridging, traffic monitoring, DLNA, basic NAS capabilities...the list goes on and on.

 

Focusing on software development while hand-balling the ridiculously expensive hardware and marketing side of things to Netgear is a fantastic match for Netduma and I applaud them for the move. I'm sure it was difficult to give up their independence and be perceived as selling out, but we're getting a far better product in return. I'd just like to see a better transition plan for R1 users to the XR500 (and beyond) because you will be left behind, sooner or later with a dated, crappy router chugging along on crippleware.

 

Long story short - DumaOS might drop on the R1 sooner or later, but my guess is it'll be DumaOS Lite. It won't do anything to address the weak aspects of the hardware, nor basic software features you'll find on every other router. Get over it and upgrade to the XR500. Your pockets will be a little lighter and you can still be pissed about a broken promise, but you'll be happier for it.

Everything you said makes sense except for the last bit about buying the xr500 this is exactly what netduma are wanting you to do. Personally I will never buy or recommend anything linked to netduma again if I buy another router it will probably be the r7800 which is basically the xr500 without Duma OS

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Everything you said makes sense except for the last bit about buying the xr500 this is exactly what netduma are wanting you to do. Personally I will never buy or recommend anything linked to netduma again if I buy another router it will probably be the r7800 which is basically the xr500 without Duma OS

To be honest the netgear range of routers are crap with their stock firmware. The XR500 with dumaOS is brilliant. I have had 3 netgear routers and the last 1 was the R7000 which I returned within 24 hours of buying it as their user interface (genie) is garbage. the other 2 ran on their old interface but are ancient now!

 

If you do decide to buy another router and refuse to buy the XR500 (which would be a shame as dumaOS is superb) I wouldnt touch a netgear router as without dumaOS like I have said are crap  in my opinion!

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To be honest the netgear range of routers are crap with their stock firmware. The XR500 with dumaOS is brilliant. I have had 3 netgear routers and the last 1 was the R7000 which I returned within 24 hours of buying it as their user interface (genie) is garbage. the other 2 ran on their old interface but are ancient now!

 

If you do decide to buy another router and refuse to buy the XR500 (which would be a shame as dumaOS is superb) I wouldnt touch a netgear router as without dumaOS like I have said are crap in my opinion!

Thanks for that I will do more research before my next purchase but I cannot justify the price tag of the xr500 and 3/4 of that price is for Duma OS it's just ridiculous I can buy 2 copies of Windows 10 for that price all I see for that money is a nice easy to use gui and geofilter which is pretty much redundant nowadays anyway

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Glad your happy with DumaOS on your router. Too bad this company cant live up to its promises of releasing anything viable thats DumaOS related on the R1. I refuse to spend my money on anything Netduma related at this point. In fact I may sell my R1 altogether.

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Glad your happy with DumaOS on your router. Too bad this company cant live up to its promises of releasing anything viable thats DumaOS related on the R1. I refuse to spend my money on anything Netduma related at this point. In fact I may sell my R1 altogether.

 

That's a fair perspective and it's reasonable to feel that way. I've chosen to step back, look at things objectively and realise the XR500 is the far better product with the best of both worlds - vastly improved hardware and the software we were promised.

 

I've given up on the R1 and moved on, which is what Netduma would doubtless like us to do. I'm ok with that because the hardware upgrade is worth it for the features I get in return. I could buy any other router for those features, but then I wouldn't get DumaOS.

 

If DumaOS does hit the R1, I hope it meets expectations and I'll keep it tucked away in the closet for that reason. But I'm not prepared to wait any longer when there's a perfectly good upgrade already out there.

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To the people who are saying buy the netgear, this was my plan I had decided to drop the R1 a while back. Then the devs changed my mind when they announced anti jitter and other features would be available exclusively to the R1. But even that seems like a lie, panic response to an angry fan base. It’s typical netduma at this point uncertain to say the least. This could all be over if they come out with an honest answer and make it clear where we stand with the R1 if they say it’s not happening then the wait is over I’d happily go out and buy the netgear. I’m not willing to spend £270 on a router which isn’t getting the features that were advertised 3 years ago. If the netgear gets exactly the same planned/promised updates I’d buy it tomorrow however from what we were told before this isn’t the case. We need more transparency and then people can make their minds up! This is one of this companies major shortcomings.

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To be honest the netgear range of routers are crap with their stock firmware. The XR500 with dumaOS is brilliant. I have had 3 netgear routers and the last 1 was the R7000 which I returned within 24 hours of buying it as their user interface (genie) is garbage. the other 2 ran on their old interface but are ancient now!

 

If you do decide to buy another router and refuse to buy the XR500 (which would be a shame as dumaOS is superb) I wouldnt touch a netgear router as without dumaOS like I have said are crap  in my opinion!

The R7000 was a good router for its time, I agree on the GUI but its meant to be set and forget and it worked very well after some bad early firmware hiccups, that's the reason its still for sale!. If you tried third party firmware like Voxels or Ledge builds on say the R7800 there are some great options. Voxels is using the main Netgear GUI with lots of GPL and OpenSSL updates and tweaks, the R7800 runs great on that, as does the ledge builds. You don't have to stick with the tired interface, but even then the R7800 has been one of the best selling routers for a long time with better performance than the Asus ones, have a look over at SNB at the tests for its performance. https://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wireless/wireless-reviews/32958-netgear-r7800-nighthawk-x4s-smart-wifi-gaming-router-reviewed

 

 Sadly the XR500 is not as good wifi wise as the R7800, even with pretty much the same hardware, hopefully in time it will be with some driver updates. Netgear make good hardware, and for most the firmware does what it should, but Netgear are awful at updating GPL and OpenSSL code and the XR500 is lacking in that department too, its sad to see ten year old code in a router so new, I was hoping Netduma may have a hand in keeping GPL and OpenSSL packages up to date but that seems to not be the case.

 

 As I said R7800 with Qualcomm's Steamboost QoS and Voxels firmware is great, set forget and have great 5Ghz range and throughput. I do love my XR500 though and DumaOS I just wish the underlying firmware was updated properly and I hope we will at least get true stealth in the next update as Port 22 is still showing as closed in a port scan when it should invisible. Bugs I expect in new builds but it would be great if the Netduma team looked though the GPL and OpenSSL code and could give netgear a kick and request updates to things like miniupnd which is ten year old code and counting! At least Merlin and Asus working together got Asus firmware to better places.

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Hi Duma Army,
 
We need to announce that the free upgrade of our new software, DumaOS, for the Netduma R1 will need to be briefly delayed due to unexpected requirement from our Legal Team. Our lawyers have advised that DumaOS on the R1 must be backwards compatible.
 
In other words, if you install DumaOS onto the R1 you should always have the option to reinstall the older R1 firmware if you prefer to go back. We had not designed the DumaOS integration with the R1 to allow for this as DumaOS is superior. But based on legal advice we now must redo the integration to allow for this. It should take, at absolute most, a few more weeks. Nothing more as we have everything else working.
 
We realise you have been waiting patiently for this upgrade and this last-minute delay is frustrating. Our entire development team is working flat out to get this last bit fixed as soon as possible as we really want you all on DumaOS.
 
For what it's worth, we're as frustrated as you are as we can't wait to start making lots of new R-Apps (features) for you all. 
 
We will get this last piece done as soon as possible and then it will be full steam ahead in delivering an explosion of new DumaOS features for you all.
 
Thank you for your continued support.
 
The ND Team

 

 
Hi Luke/Fraser, 
 
 
Hoping we could get an update on when the DumaOS update is planned or is there a way I can set up a notification on arrival?
 
 
Manually checking is tiresome. 
 
 
Cheers,

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Hi Luke/Fraser, 
 
 
Hoping we could get an update on when the DumaOS update is planned or is there a way I can set up a notification on arrival?
 
 
Manually checking is tiresome. 
 
 
Cheers,

 

Waiting for this one to be removed too.

 

Apparently its against code of conduct to ask for an update, their insecurity is going too far.

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